Please remove the rest penalty attached to stable Water and Food. |
Paralogize « Citoyen » 1527814440000
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Please remove the inherent rest penalty that the consumption of regular or above quality water brings. *Diminishing the overall penalty in regards to the other consumables is a reasonable change as well. There are not many real disadvantages that are given to the player for consuming toxic or poor quality water. So my suggestion would also ask that (if we must have a rest penalty) you then limit the rest penalty strictly to expired or toxic consumables. The rest penalty bundled with the extreme strain that critical attacks place on thirst, the limited backpack space and the overkill rest cost that will sometimes accompany the looting of 'said' drinks or food makes for a less than enjoyable experience at times. This penalty also seems to directly contradict the benefits of the buff system. If I rest at any time during an adventure or on the field to continue looting then there seems to be a wipe of all of my buffs. Please keep in mind that I am completely burning out of rest while being conservative with the items that I loot. If I was experiencing a 5 minute burn out while recklessly looting everything in sight then this suggestion would not even exist. In closing, I believe that the removal of the penalty that follows the consumption of quality water (and the reduction of the penalty that follows superb food) will take players a step closer to reaching a more fluent gaming experience. -----------Personal Comments----------- (Feel free to skip) Halfway through an SP I find myself burning through multiple water bottles which in turn limits me to (at times) looting three items. I have to regularly double-back through an empty SP to loot the remaining items. Constantly soloing clusters of buggy avengers is a less than ideal moment for me. *Edited to include Podostro's suggestion regarding the food. *Edited to specialize my post. I originally wrote this very late into the night and did not emphasize on my primary objective which is almost purely based around water. Dernière modification le 1527917160000 |
Podostro « Citoyen » 1527887400000
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Stale food do give "Food poisoning" stat randomly. I don't think the rest penalty should be removed, but dimished. Spending 10 stamina on drink/food consumption seems a lil overdone. I would reduce it to 5. And if the food is good, high or exceptional quality; add the chance that it will randomly restore 1/2/3 stamina, as well. This way the "penalty" is greatly reduced, close to being virtually negated; but it's still there, chipping out at your stamina unless you're careful. That seems to me a more sensible and balanced approach to making it "costly" to eat/drink while not in a firecamp. BTW, about the buff system negation... Sleeping in the bed, or using unlit firecamp without adding fuel will restore stamina without removing buffs (nor debuffs) Bed does reset the exp though Dernière modification le 1527887640000 |
Paralogize « Citoyen » 1527912780000
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Podostro a dit : I am aware of the indigestion that may follow the consumption of expired food. This is why I specifically mentioned the lack of a real con for consuming "toxic or poor quality water". Have I simply been lucky to never receive it from toxic water? Podostro a dit : Understandable. I believe it should be removed or greatly diminished as you've stated because it is a counter-intuitive design choice. I fail to see the practical appeal to "You may no longer be capable of looting this Gun from the SP Package because you've just drank an exceptional bottle of water". Some may see the solution to be, "Why not lay a campfire?" and my answer to this is because the campfire removes the exceptional quality buffs that I have on. My only other choice is to double-back through the SP and (in my perspective) this occurs due to an oversight in the design. Now, if the design is indeed intended to cause this scenario then I simply desire to voice that it is a choice that hampers my experience and that you all may take this as it be. Podostro a dit : That is a reasonable improvement from the current system, but there are two things that prevent me from accepting it entirely. 1. Average water would then consume 5 Stamina. Good/High/Exceptional water will now reduce 4/3/2 rest total with your change, correct? While this is an improvement I simply do not see why you are being punished at all for drinking high quality water. Why exactly does drinking the finest water that you're able to consume have to compromise your survival at all? The very implementation only serves to impede the player and there seems to be little to no sense in that penalty. I wish for the game to solely penalize the players 'rest' when they consume toxic or expired water instead. This would reward players who create or manage their water resources while also maintaining the realistic consequence for survivors who drink any and everything that they can get their hands on. 2. I personally do not want to completely remove the penalty regarding food. I do not even want to alter most beverages. It is completely understandable that copious consumption of food while in the field can and should negatively affect performance. Albeit, some items should temporarily raise your rest bar's peak and then increase the rate at which it burns or falls off over-time.. (The energy drink for example, but that's for another topic.) Podostro a dit : I did not know about this specific feature. Is this intentional or is this an exploit that is soon to be removed? Dernière modification le 1527916920000 |
Podostro « Citoyen » 1527955080000
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Paralogize a dit : Yes, you have been lucky. I've barely only got it twice or thrice. But the effect IS a real con. By virtually negating your chance to do a CRIT HIT; it's seriously damping your DMG output. this is specially dangerous when you have a big enough threat level, or turn on plenty strategies in the strategy table. Paralogize a dit : The answer is very simple. You need to pay someway. Why should you not pay anything at all, when you're actually gaining something? That's the base of the "survival" genre. Doing something, costs something. IRL, even breathing has a cost; it has a chance of getting you sick from breathing in viruses :P Even so, IRL consuming food or drinking has a fatigue cost too; yes, it's barely perceivable, but it exists. If you don't believe me, try to stay awake after having a 10 course dinner :D Paralogize a dit : If your main issue is with water, then DON'T FIGHT, just dodge and wiggle your way through the hordes. So you won't deplete your "hydration" by uselessly attacking. Paralogize a dit : AFAIK it's by design. The unlit camps are a very cool tool to farm exp bonus by raising threat level. And when doing this you're going through a lot of weapons, foods and drinks and picking weapons, food and drink to keep fighting and consuming :) And in light of your seemingly focusing on WATER. Have in mind it's pretty unbalanced to have one kind of drink to cost fatigue (soda, energy drinks, juices) and another which doesn't (water). Simply reducing the fatigue cost by half, would let you consume about double the food/drink. And adding the random stamina regeneration to good/high/exp quality items, is a good enough added bonus IMO And since we are bringing real life to the table, energy drinks(sugar drinks) should give a stamina bonus too; immediately followed by a stamina debuff. (Sugar rush, and consequent sugar crush) As a side note: I believe Toxic water should always be treated as expired water, and/or cause toxic debuff. Or even better, there shouldn't exists three types of water, toxic, dirty and drinkable; because it's confusing. Only one type of water should exist; and how it's usable and it's effects (buff/debuff) should depend on it's quality Dernière modification le 1527955260000 |
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I agree with podostro just my 2 cents. toxic water should be just that toxic dirty water should essentially take over the "expired" water because water is water it doesn't really expire. Then there is water and we all know there are different qualities of potable clean water. |
Paralogize « Citoyen » 1528113900000
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Podostro a dit : Your statement inadvertently ignores that this game does not whole-hardheartedly commit itself to "everything costs". Which is obvious based on the many things within this game that does not burden a cost. High Quality Water should be among one of them for the reasons I previously stated. The penalty can create scenarios that only exist to slow down the pacing of the game. Doing something -- costs something isn't the only base of a survival game. It is one of the genre's prerogatives that it holds over the other genres and it can easily be toned up or down without compromising the "genre" itself. I do not want to have to elaborate on this point further, but I can if need be. The rest penalty on fine water is only making "easy" content take longer to complete. It is not directly making the content more difficult. Podostro a dit : Your point here about costs (especially about food since I am not arguing for 0-cost food) in real life is irrelevant. Drinking a bottle of water does not reduce 1/10th of my energy in real life. You may exert minute effort to drink the bottle of water, but the trade off for doing so grants you more in the long run. Being properly hydrated allows your heart to increase your blood volume. This causes the exact opposite of what you claim. Your statement regarding the dinner is misinforming. The chemistry that occurs which triggers the fatigue is a lot more complex than (I ate so I sleep now). What you ate, what your body is accustomed to eating, if said meal causes inflammation or an overload on the stomach, etc are all variants. It isn't uncommon for some high-performing athletes to convert a mass of food into a mass of energy. So you certainly are not entirely correct. You're arguing in favor of extreme realism in a survival game that doesn't even have perma-death or the constant threat of being infected. Podostro a dit : Now you're arguing against realism in favor of artificial balance. Your points seemingly contradict one another here. It is completely realistic that high quality water should tax the body the least out of the majority of drinks. You're essentially saying "it's not fair that clean water doesn't drain you while a giant bottle of sugary soda does". Why are you even arguing against that if you're keen to survival games being somewhat 'realistic'? Podostro a dit : How do you have the audacity to label attacking as useless when a core element of the very game (the SPs) require that players reach a preset kill limit? I have already pointed out that the SP is one of the main sources of my dislike for the penalty. You should clarify what your definition of "useless" is. That statement makes it seem as if you aren't aware of what game it is that you're playing. If someone just so happens to participate in an empty SP then soloing 100 zombies will be the reality for the player. (I really do hope that your next suggestion isn't "don't do the SP and hope that more people show up".) I can not disagree with you any more than I already do on this specific point. If they do not want players to fight so often then they should address the very nature of the combat itself. Most zombies in this game are not a threat. They're virtually just very hostile pinatas. Having to play in a way where all you do is avoid non-threats because you may not be able to pick up a piece of paper afterward makes little to no sense. You are implying that this is the purpose of the "survival" genre and it seems misleading at best. One of the main purposes of the genre is to survive against the harsh and dangerous elements of the world. If they do not want us to engage in frequent combat (While following a reasonable design) then they will need to make the zombies more dangerous and we will not fight as often. ---Tl;dr--- The poor design of the water penalty simply makes it so that you may be unable to pick up a pen just because you killed a few zombies along the way. (This is a nonsensical design choice because while I will somehow not be able to pick up the pen I will still somehow be able to fight for 4 more hours.) To be honest, combat draining your rest gauge makes infinitely more sense than water draining your rest. (Don't do this.) You have failed to create a logical argument that explains why drinking a single bottle of exceptional water should have the potential to exhaust the remainder of your rest. (I only believe that consuming too many bottles of water should negatively impact your rest.) To prevent any further confusion with you I will tell you that I am only using 'realism' as a way to relate to you. A level playing-field as you will. I am not using the real world as the sole purpose of my feedback. I am mainly speaking on a clashing design within this Casual-Survival game. I fear that some people may not realize that this game is not seeking to be as restricting as they think. I am suggesting that the best form of hydration should not actively prevent players from picking up an item. Collecting items already takes care of loot-happy people by consuming their rest. I still agree that the overall cost of quality food is better off reduced as you have mentioned. Do you also think it makes sense that picking up a mask may reduce your food gauge? If your answer is "Yes" then that explains everything that I need to know about your point of view. At the end of the day this is fully opened to discussion and I enjoy reading well-thought-out opinions. Dernière modification le 1528114140000 |
Podostro « Citoyen » 1528122240000
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It's pretty obvious you consider my opinions as arguing with you. They are not. They are opinion on how to implement an improvement in regard to a very bothersome mechanic, without actually removing it; contrary to your request, but not against it. TL;DR: Have a nice life! |
Paralogize « Citoyen » 1528181460000
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Podostro a dit : We both have points that we partially agree with and disagree with. I don't think that your posts are of the antagonizing nature. I'm content with our discussion and I'm happy to read your replies. I've learned that the basis of your view stems from your desire to both keep the survival element as close to home (by maintaining a drain) while also minimizing the negative influence this drain currently has. (The drain is far too harsh on critical-builds). I challenge views in order to completely understand them. I apologize if my methods seem rigorous. Have a good day or night as well. |