My humble concerns and opinions about this game |
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Ok let's start with why I love Nekodancer. I LOVE rhythm games. Mania games specifically. I have played o2jam, osu!mania, and DJMax Trilogy to name exmaples. I also love Transformice. And seeing this weird new icon with a cat doing a dance pose kinda excited me and hopes that this is a rhythm game. AND IT IS! Now, my problem. It's getting quite boring. Why I love these rhythm games is the difficulty and the excitement of the notes dropping and hitting it at the right time. But this game is just too damn easy. The only way I could lose is someone with better accuracy or if the bugs and glitches of the game doesn't happen to me. So, it's really great to hear they will add new features soon. Especially the note editor. But I want you readers to watch this vid first. http://youtu.be/YC2-qGBYLRQ These are the kind of speed and difficulty I'm used to. Though I could not perfect that song, I can finish it and it's so fun playing with that hardness and speed of the game. So maybe expect people to create maps as difficult as this. So, once the editor comes out, I hope it can also have the ability to do this. Hard and fast. More than 280bpm. Maybe I'll also make a few maps too. :3 Now the more on the gameplay. I really think the freestyle mode in the middle of the songs is a stupid feature. It ruins the flow of the game. And 2nd, I think the idea of a penalty when hitting a button without notes is bad for a rhythm game.That is why most rhythm games have 5 different score. 300, 200, 100, 50, 10 and a miss. Or Perfect, Great, Good, Ok, and Bad..and a miss. You just extend the hitbox for a bad hit so that people couldn't smash the keys. The bad score actually loses you life though it still gives you a small score. Most of the time in this game, you get an Oops and a Miss if you try to hit a note too early or too late and that's also really annoying. Every time should be freestyle mode and smashing keys when there are notes should be allowed. Next is the power-ups. This feature is what makes Nekodancer so unique. I still want this feature but probably have a different room for more people who doesn't want to deal with that. Or like this is the regular room. Or party room, whoo! When asking people how hard this game is, its almost split on the too easy and too hard bunch. Maybe a some kind of room where people vote on what difficulty of songs they long to play. Like this on some dead rhythm game that did this feature. There will be 3 or 4 difficulties, easy, normal, hard and insane. Songs will be chosen randomly or maybe voted by the people in the room. And on that song, there are at least 4 or at least 2 difficulties mapped. People choose what difficulty they want. And everyone is satisfied. As for points, since harder maps tend to have more notes, maybe add 4 separate stats. You know, for easy mode stats, normal mode stats, and so on. This way, each room wouldn't have an unfair advantage and people wouldn't find it too difficult anymore and the much pro-er players has something to play with. Finally, the other gripes I have in this game. I don't understand the scoring system. Usually, the more combo you have, a multiplier bar goes up. It's so weird here. I don't know how the scoring works. So, inb4, add more scores than just perfect, good, oops, and miss. Please, please, PLEASE, add a custom speed feature. The notes goes too slow.. ugh. Please add custom keys. I rather have s,d,j and k instead of left, up, down, right. I guess that's all. Other stuff is already mentioned in the suggestion thread. Though, maybe most of the stuff I said is already suggested, but I just put more in dept details about it. I hope it's ok to post this stuff. I really love this game and the only reason I'm still staying playing this game is because I love Atelier801 and how this is more social based than most rhythm games I played. You have a cat avatar and talk to other people while playing! How cool is that!? So, if anyone's reading this wholly, thanks for your time. I just want this out of my head. So there. I guess that's all I want to say. I think... Now enjoy a gameplay of me playing osu!mania. http://youtu.be/A9-MApSJXtc TL:DR I love this game but it's really flawed and I write my opinions blah blah. Dernière modification le 1410702240000 |
Techtriostep « Citoyen » 1410702240000
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I have seen your playthroughs in nekodancer and you are awesome. i do have to admit you are right, even though there are many people still getting the hang of this type of games. Seeing that they have multiple games to handle, some progress might be on hold. :edit: omg Far East Nightbird~~ Dernière modification le 1410702420000 |
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techtriostep a dit : Thanks! Also, editted the post and added teh videos. I can't seem to make the links work.. oh well. :3 |
Jkssn 1410702360000
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[Modéré par Shamousey, raison : Accidental double post.] |
Sunflowrcake « Citoyen » 1410703380000
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i do have to agree with you on custom key bindings/an option to always have speed on, but i really don't exactly agree with 280+ bpm. kick drum metronomes is your best friend the last thing i want this game to go is to hell with constant 280 bpm songs everywhere you go. |
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Sunflowrcake a dit : Oh no, thats not what I meant about the 280+ bpm thing. It's not connected to metronomes song thing. The current engine used to create notes reads beats at 280 beats per minute intervals or whatever it's called. Look at the 1st video link I gave. As you can see on that fast many notes part, it's clearly more than 280 beats per minute. The plus side of creating custom notes for each song is different difficulties which actually have less than 280 bpm so it wont go to "hell." xD |
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We know that feel. But nobody from the dev's team gives a fuck about this game since first few weeks after release. At least it looks like that from this point of view. Jkssn a dit : Check this. |
Ditzee « Citoyen » 1410715260000
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There's so much here that I agree with, we just have to hope that we get another new feature update soon so the game will start improving. Also, am I the only one who thinks that the arrows come down too slow? For example, it's more exciting/fun when I get hit with a speed. I would personally love it to be more spread and faster than compact and slower. |
Livcorish « Citoyen » 1410719820000
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Rar a dit : They have 4 games to work on. A track editor is being worked on, but they're also working on a new Skill Tree, a Zombie mode for Fortoresse, and many other things. They are a small, but successful company. I personally love that they're a small company because you get to know the creators, however they also have four games that require attention and they can't do all of them at once. I don't believe that they "don't give a fuck" about the game, they're just busy. If you've ever seen Melibellule's blog, (Here), you'd know that they work as hard as they possibly can on these games and people who assume that they're slacking off really irritate them. |
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Livcorish a dit : It looks like because we do not know what exactly is going on there. No, srsly, dead silence makes things even worse. Meli's blog is full of despair about necodancer fail, trello has no info about current state of things. That's definitely wrong. |
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Livcorish a dit : All this is what I absolutely agree with. Plus, atelier is not going to make an exact ddr clone. They want to create a unique spin on their games. They also want to make it so that it does not scare some of the beginners away. This is probably where separate modes of gameplay would come in. Probably one with harder songs and no power ups. All I can really is go play ddr or ffr if you want something that's more familiar to you. The thing that's different about this game is that it's massive multiplayer and players usually have to practice A LOT to get excellent scores on difficult songs. This is especially difficult with songs that they will never have seen before being presented to them every single day. They cannot easily add a custom speed feature because this is flash player. Melibellule already told us earlier on when this was suggested that flash handles high speeds very poorly, and this could be difficult to achieve. Rar a dit : I found the post you were talking about. http://i.imgur.com/IYx43aR.png I think the reason some people get turned off by the game because it's already too difficult for them. In addition, the already low activity just spirals into an endless cycle of further inactivity as players lack others to play with. The thing about transformice is that it has the level-up system, which actually encourages you to play on and to improve. Bouboum performed better initially than nekodancer because there were no other branch games to transformice when it actually came out, so people were a lot more willing to try it, and they were a lot more hooked onto it because it had a moderately low difficulty in most regards. Atelier should, rather than creating more difficulties suited to higher level players, focus on stopping the lower level players from being turned off by the game. Yes, a vanilla type room with a default set of tracks does sound like a nice idea for beginners. But atelier would have to receive help from the community for that, because the track generator as it is doesn't seem to suit the way new players try to adapt to the game. Atelier needs to take its time striking a balance between satisfying higher and lower level players. Give them their time. They are working extremely hard to bring us the newest features of this game. Heck, what they've already done with making dance-dance type games more social is already revolutionary enough, so cut them some slack. ================================================= As for the track editor itself, I've already given it some thought. Notes obviously can't be placed too close together because nekodancer doesn't seem to register notes that are too close together properly. I'm not really sure how atelier can fix this up. Ddr games obviously seem to have a much narrower hitbox when notes are closer together. In addition, you can only seem to tap one arrow in a row at a rate of about 10 hits per second at maximum, before the game just stops registering your inputs. I'm pretty sure this is a flash thing. However, the cat can exceed this amount (20 hits per second with two different notes) if more variety in the notes is included. The track in nekodancer doesn't have any bars indicating the rhythm of the music. Probably if this is to stay excluded, then atelier will have to give us a precise editor with a waveform or a function that allows us to hear the music piece by piece. Again, I don't know how atelier can do this, because youtube editor itself only splits off the sound into tenths, and it'd be extremely difficult to do something similar in a flash game. Dernière modification le 1410731460000 |
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solfn a dit : With most of the stuff they added for the game, with the social and power ups, it's already unique in its own way. I just hope they at least copy what made DDR really fun to play. a dit : IKR! But, I really also like Nekodancer. So, I just usually stay to play with friends or just at least 20 minutes before I get bored and leave. xD a dit : Look at a flash based rhythm game called FeelTheBeats. Yeah it lags, but it works and I put the speed to times 2 there. Plus its 7K and I can get better accuracy there than this game because I can increase speed. I'm pretty sure it will be fine. a dit : I hope Atelier realize how having a rhythm in their collection of games is a really awesome idea. Rhythm games are really fun for both casual and competitive gamers and if they just give this game more time, people will eventually come. A track editor will definitely remove the too easy and too hard groups with different difficulties per song. a dit : I hope I don't sound like I'm accusing Atelier to be slackers. I am aware they are small and and have other games they are focused on making. It's just a shame that the potential of an awesome rhythm game could be wasted. Cuz I'll totally play the crap out of this game with better features that are similar to popular rhythm games. a dit : It need BIGGER hitbox! D:< a dit : Ok so 1st I tried to button smash and was able to create 13 hits for a second in a single button.And in game, when I try to kill myself or in freestyle, it registers every input I made when button smashing every key. I think I'm confused. But so far, no problem with the game not registering my inputs. a dit : Again, the FeelTheBeats has an in-game track editor which is also in flash.. I think. You could try it out. :3 But I guess for them to get this idea, using youtube as the basis of your song isn't really that reliable. I wonder if they would add a feature where you could upload your midi, mp3, wav, blah blah as your song file? Or use alternatives like soundcloud? IDK, I'm noob with programming. |
Techtriostep « Citoyen » 1410762420000
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I doubt uploading mp3 files will happen due to copyright issues, that's why baffbot deleted its music feature. And even if it is possible, mp3 files are files, they can contribute to lag. Neko dancer should have a popularity boost when the partion editor comes out, but not for long. I do hope after the release of zombie mode in fort and skill tree in tfm, they will focus on new ideas for neko dancer. I saw a post in meli's blog that suggested jubeat and reflec beat and even though I know they are not possible to put into this game, I was pleasantly surprise meli has also been thinking about it. Dernière modification le 1410762480000 |
Musicaholic « Citoyen » 1410766920000
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My problem with the game is that in most songs, the arrows don't go along with the rhythm at all. In the first video you had posted, the notes go nearly flawlessly with the rhythm,. It's like every keyboard tap goes with the beat of the song and that's really, really cool. In Nekodancer, it feels like the notes are completely off sync compared to the songs, to a point where it often doesn't feel like a rhythm game at all, and sometimes I mess up because I try to follow the rhythm and not the visuals. Hopefully the release of the track editor will help with this issue. It kind of discourages me how long the game's gone without being updated as well, but I'm not going to complain because it's better to have a good, refined, yet delayed release, than a rushed and incomplete one. As for your suggestions, I agree for the most part. It's kind of silly that you get a penalty for pressing an arrow if there are no notes dropping. I believe I've read a suggestion before about rooms with certain names having certain difficulties. Something like /room easy1, for an example. I think that'd be cool, but at this point any type of difficulty adjusting system would be handy. I'm all for customized arrow speeds as well. |
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So basically atelier are headed into the complete unknown, huh? They gotta figure out how to get past YouTube's sound editing restrictions (possibly connected to the rate at which neko's generator can generate notes), as well as how to alter the speed of the game on flash without lagging it for everybody, as well as how to make each edited track distributable to every player, as well as how to segment each player's skill levels without ruining the experience for one particular group of players. Big challenges ahead. Hard times. I hope they do find some way to do this without ending in failure. A YouTube oriented soundtrack set seems really difficult to work with. |
Ewafer « Citoyen » 1411752240000
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I honestly think the devs expected Nekodancer for whatever reason, would be a huge hit. Turns out it wasn't so they no longer prioritise it as much as they had originally planned. This is just pure speculation on my part though. I agree that nekodancer gets boring quite fast. There are other, more original and better multiplayer rythem games like osu. Nekodancer doesn't really stand out for me. |
Rayzord « Citoyen » 1411907160000
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In my opinion, nekodancer is quite slow to me. Well it may be fast or medium speed to others, but not me. In all rhythm games, my normal tapping speed is twice the speed of nekodancer's arrow speed. My fastest was 9 notes per second, in my own rhythm game on my phone ( the beat mp3 ) . |
Emmyemmyblue « Citoyen » 1411981260000
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And to think I was about to read this. O.O So much. Pfft I'm lazy. On to reading I go. |
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2 months and still no update? :0 |
Queenlordess « Citoyen » 1417236600000
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Nekodancer is pretty abandoned... :( |