A0xis a dit :

Semi-realism isn't good enough, you need to strive for something bigger than your current abilities. If no exact reference exists, reference several images at once to map where your character ought to be (but thats such a boring and cliché pose, cute girl dying in a pool of blood, that if you dont find a reference for it you'll find a better one with better composition and character)

yoo youre not wrong, what i was initially trying to draw is her death, since she really did die at some point lol

and trust me, i am striving for something bigger than my current abilities. most kids my age draw out of boredom, but, even if it looks like it, every single drawing of mine shows that im trying to improve bit by bit, but its really not that easy imo
lately ive been starting to draw in a more realistic kind of way, y'know, with small steps since i dont wanna get stuck in mud. doing that will just leave me at a level i cant get past

The secret is to give up Anime until you have the abiliy to draw from life, once you're above anime and understand real anatomy, then you'll be able to go back to it and really see what it is that makes Anime Anime, if that makes sense. Anime itself is just pit hole after pit hole of bad habits and poor execution if its what you're starting with.

any help would be appreciated, thanks!

I would like some critique on this sketch of a random chick.
I know that the face is lop-sided, and that would get fixed in a more detailed sketch before lineart.
I also know the eyes are weird, and that will get fixed as well.

More looking towards the anatomy, but anything else is useful!

To add: this is not supposed to be anime. Just my style of humans. :/

Grincreep a dit :

Spoiler

Hiya!
im not going to critique much of the drawing, but i felt like this might be a very important detail that you should know!

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e: please just respect that i want nothing to do with you v

Thats beautiful fourth, a spectacular use of referance. I hope you paid close attention when mapping where the features went so that you can build your mental library. The Triangle of Beauty-- look into it. Soon I'd recommend you dive into rendering black and white to give your work photorealism. I'm going to buy Photoshop soon as I can afford it so to bring my work to the highest attainable level of rendering.

Grin: You're simply not good enough to have a style. A style is a very sophisticated, planned, and researched tool that takes time, thought, and effort to achieve. What you call a style is actually a collection of bad habits, misremembered anatomy, and mistakes. Of course when you learn the proportion scheme of the face that you may tweek and build upon it, but when was the last time you googled for the anatomy of a face. Facial anatomy is just as important to your progress as an artist as bodily anatomy is. Bad habits and mistakes are no less bad habits and mistakes by shielding yourself and calling them a style. There's not a single thing in this drawing proportioned correctly; no room for a stomache, a foreshortened spine even for the "style" you were going for' and the arms were ... An attempt, at best (have you never seen Davinci's human star thing). Cartoons are the hardest thing to pull off, dont even attempt it at your level. I'm only allowing myself to because I've drawn realism and portraite my entire life, and my cartoons are still pretty shit. For now, just look up proportion guides, and maybe some anatomical shape constructions for human anatomy, and please don't put your eyes so far apart all the time, its not doing the effect you think it is.

Small note (unrelated to critique)
Stop saying things are one way and then acting a completely different way. Its either over or it isn't, and what the hell do you still want from me if its not. We don't have to be friends but you need to just get over me already, its bad for your health.

e: ^ Why don'y you start by not vague posting about me if you don't want a response from the fucking goblin king.

Thefourthone a dit :

Spoiler

any help would be appreciated, thanks!

I suggest maybe not to try and color the hair in an "anime" sort of style so you could match the rest of the realism on your piece (like the nose and the lips)!
Otherwise it's all good to me, eyes are well proportioned and at level with the ears. The nose is a reasonable size and there's a large enough gap between the lips and the base of the nose. Well done!

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Grincreep asked for a critique* yet you sit there and insult them by telling them they aren't good enough to hold up a style? Why?

Your description of Fourth's proportion is vauge and unhelpful, thats why I pointed him to the Beauty Triangle, which will show him exactly where the most ideal features line up and what size the "large enough gap" has to actually be. A final thing to mentioned is professionals stay away from references with "blown out" lighting as it makes features appear flat so details and important information are lost.

I typed Golditale instead of Grincreep by mistake, though honestly it's applicable to both, and you, and everyone from Vullo to Digitalpanda. My views on style, the greatest art communty's views on style, don't change depending on how much I like the person; and for people who put no effort of their own in before coming here need to be told off for it. Unfortunately I can't just make people spectacular alone, they have to recognize their faults and make their own mindful effort. No such thing as coddling.

A valid criticism would be why I hold myself to a different standard than all others, but if you can produce for me a masters in visual arts then I will certainly bend over backwards. I didn't finish school only because I couldn't justify the price, but I was there long enough to understand where I am and where I need to be in a way no one else this site could. I help when I can though my journey but otherwise we're climbing different mountains.

Hey not really, no one deserves rudeness in something like criticism, but you at least did map out key points they need work on.

Simply more practice and use of more references and diversity in work will help Grin out, don't jump to the gun so quickly that they're incapable of eventually finding their own style! Every one does eventually if you give enough effort!

Practice is actually the worst advice to give; but thats a topic for another discussion.

You missed the entire point. No one should start making a style until they know what they're doing, otherwise they'll just keep making the same mistakes every time get sit down to draw. This isn't positivity corner this is real life and real art and there are real guidelines and rules that Can Be Broken, Yes, But You HAVE to KNOW THEM FIRST. *breathes* You're only going to produce more mediocure Deviantartists if you let them think they're allowed to be wrong.

I never said they we're incapable, ai simply said, "Not yet."

I haven't met a single artist on this site who I think is good enough to produce a real, consistant style, even I'm failing at it (but less over time), but if any lurkers think they can show me up then I encourage the enthusiasm.

its one of my bests yet

When you flip it around you'll see the eye is a tad lower than it ought to be because the snout is a lot too high-- that's because the upper maw is fixed onto the skull around the centre but the lower maw-- the jaw-- is on a hinge, so its the only one which moves when the mouth opens. Besides the slight anatomy error, it's a beautiful Red-Green colour harmony (Red and Green are complementary colours, as you should know) and there's both a beautiful twisting line of action and sketchiness to the piece that compliments the anguish of your character. *claps*

I would like to ask for a critique today, also; I don't require someone who knows anything about art, I would just like general impressions and such (but more complex knowledge shouldn't feel shunned)

A0xis a dit :

When you flip it around you'll see the eye is a tad lower than it ought to be because the snout is a lot too high-- that's because the upper maw is fixed onto the skull around the centre but the lower maw-- the jaw-- is on a hinge, so its the only one which moves when the mouth opens. Besides the slight anatomy error, it's a beautiful Red-Green colour harmony (Red and Green are complementary colours, as you should know) and there's both a beautiful twisting line of action and sketchiness to the piece that compliments the anguish of your character. *claps*

I would like to ask for a critique today, also; I don't require someone who knows anything about art, I would just like general impressions and such (but more complex knowledge shouldn't feel shunned)

Spoiler

thank u very much! i have to say that your art is really great but i cant really judge it since i dont have the knowledge

I'm not quoting anything because there's too much and I'm lazy.

First off, excuse me???? I'm a self taught artist, and yes I do use references. A lot.
Excuse me for not being able to go to school for art and being better than YOU. All I asked was some help with the anatomy, not someone telling me I shouldn't be drawing in my own style because I'm not good enough. Of course I know I'm not good enough. I fucking hate my art, but I do it anyway to learn and to get better. Apparently that's something you don't understand about a majority of this site. Most of us are self taught, unlike you. The only way any of us are going to get better is by critiques to help with certain perspectives and using references, etc.

Honestly, who cares what YOU think? Yeah you might be better than most of us, but don't be egotistical about it. We learn in our own ways.
I'm fed up with you telling people they need to give up on their styles and what they prefer to draw. This site doesn't revolve around you, it revolves around artists and their styles.

I refuse to "stop" drawing what I enjoy drawing. Hate it all you want, but I look for improvement with every sketch, not someone telling me I shouldn't be doing it.
This site was boring before you came along, but you weren't for the greater good. You try to give tutorials on how certain proportions should be on mice, people take that advice into their own style, and you don't like it because they are "copying" your style. You give/gave critiques on threads that you had no permission to give critiques on.
This is why I no longer have respect for this site, nor wish to be around much anymore. Your rudeness has rubbed off on others making these threads no longer fun.

@Goldi - thank you, I will keep this in mind and make changes to my current sketch. You are a darling. <3

@Cake - thank you as well. <3

As a side note - I do put effort into my art. Maybe not 110% all the time, but I do put alot of effort into it.

One of the rules of this thread is to not get offended over harsh critiques, it's right by the rule that says not to use style as an excuse, LOL, you really played into that one.

You cant draw in "your style" and improve at the same time, that's not what a style is and that's not how improvement works. Reread the critique because you obviously didn't understand it.

Also, I'm pretty sure I still count as self taught considering all I do most days is search for lessons and guidance. Just because I put effort into everything I do doesn't make me less pure-- Pretty sure you didn't use a reference for that drawing (and if you did, you don't know how to use one), I never told you to stop drawing, and I certainly never said I hated your work (it has to have some substance before I can choose to hate something).

I agree I'm a bad influence but what does that have to do with my critique, that's just character assassination (and I do that myself just fine).

I'm just going to keep working hard and getting better and everyone like you just keep at your same old games expecting skills, knowledge, and talent to just fall into your laps-- less competition for me, anyway.

I accidentally gave a critique on a colour pallet, yes, was that wrong, yes, but I didn't intend any harm for it.

(When I made that paranoid little rambling about people stealing my style, I wasn't on the medications I am now-- so that's kind of embarrassing you'd bring it up! I'm cool with it, now, mostly; I still silently judge people in the back of my mind for it but I can't just flip a switch and make all my issues go away as much as I try. I haven't been suicidal at all and I've only had one episode in the past two weeks, I'm feeling so... good. Really, really good. I'm sorry I cant accelerate this process and I can't promise what will happen to my personality at the other end of it, but I really think you ought to hold out a bit of hope for me. I don't even vent art at all these days.)

And finally, Mootsoup was always a bad person, don't blame me for that (ai don't kill me soupy). I take responsibility for Katssuumy but I told her off for talking to people like that, don't worry. I don't know anyone else who I've rubbed off on but I've already apologised at least twice for corroding the community (thrice, this isn't intentional, I swear to god).

I didn't get offended, just stated that I'm self taught (along with the majority of this site) with knowledge that my art sucks 100% of the time.
You did say "You're simply not good enough to have a style." That's what I was defending.

How is one supposed to draw without having a style? Nobody ever draws the same. Not everyone can or chooses to draw realistically. I've tried, used references, and whatever else, but I still prefer the cartoony looking humans.

I do work hard and get better. I don't keep at the "same old games" expecting knowledge to fall in my lap. I don't expect that at all. In fact, I do try different things with every drawing I do, not sure if anyone ever notices. And secretly, I do look up tutorials and use them to the fullest. Or at least attempt to. I've never been that great at drawing humans, even before I got into digital art. But that doesn't mean that I will never be able to if I'm self taught. I use references mostly for the humans, but everytime I think that I'm doing a good job on it, there's something that's wrong with it. Especially the chest on females.

And you're right, I didn't use a reference for that drawing, figured I'd adventure and try it from scratch but apparently that isn't the correct thing to do....ever.

As for bringing up people stealing your style, sorry for that. I was in a rant and it came up. Tbh, I've been sketching out mice poses using your tutorial but they never look decent enough to post or give inspiration to draw mice at this time.

A style, a real style, is a highly sophisticated set of rules and guidelines-- when you say you draw within a style that makes the automatic assumption that you draw within the confines of a certain set of parameters... and that's really, REALLY dangerous for a learner because you learn to draw things certain ways, and these certain ways can be disastrously mal-proportioned and broken.

Never be ashamed to use tutorials, oh my god, I download hours worth of Artist's critiques and beginners guides and everything I get my hands on. I don't understand what you mean by self taught because there's no such thing. You are not locked in a blank room all day and told to be a davinci, you're always looking at forms and colours and other people's work even when you think you're not, so why the hell would it be a crime to actively and fully seek out those opportunities and learning experiences??

If I didn't religiously stalk Istebrak's videos I couldn't have drawn my latest piece, at all, because she's the one who taught me about the steps toward character design and how to use form studies and how to render shapes and when to blur and when not to. I wouldn't know what a colour harmony was without accidentally finding a video about it on Youtube and I wouldn't know the steps to take towards becoming an effective artist without researching seminars either. The first thing I did when I started drawing in December was look up how to improve at art, and I took that advice to the extreme. The more I learn the more I realise how much there actually is for me to still learn and work towards; and I don't study anatomy as much as I know I should but there's SO MUCH out there to know and do and think about that I'm just a little overwhelmed at the moment. You have to just bite the bullet and get help because you're missing so much wonder and beauty by milling around on the fundamental levels trying to be your own self made man by turning your nose up at skeletal breakdowns and shape constructions; you're not self taught no matter how much you think you are, you're just breaking your shins at the start of a fucking marathon that is artistic aspiration.

*violently shakes the site out of its bad habits*

never fucking mind im not getting muted for this

I don't know what it is you said but I hope it wasnt about me ovo''

Bump please crit this

A0xis a dit :

I would like to ask for a critique today, also; I don't require someone who knows anything about art, I would just like general impressions and such (but more complex knowledge shouldn't feel shunned)

Spoiler

i have noticed you say don't form a style until you know proper anatomy, and i am assuming this applies to your mouse drawings as well.
i looked at your drawing and nothing screamed "this is a mouse" to me, rather it actually looked like a wolf/fox hybrid or something. i guess the fur may be at fault there but ingame it still looks like a mouse
the snout also tells me that "this doesnt look like a mouse" mostly because foxes have large nose and square snouts and that go up, meanwhile mouse snouts are more triangular that kind go down with smaller, rounder noses
also, mice have thin limbs and a thin tail, while your drawing doesnt really show that, so, again, makes it harder to realize its a mouse
(google disney mouses for a reference if you want to draw in a cartoony art style and see the points that makes the character look like a mouse)
one more thing, the scarf looks like it was made out of glass with a shading. try showing that its made of wool perhaps using a more softer shading, maybe.

also another thing about art styles, everyone has those even if you think they don't, art style should be something that comes to you naturally. shit, even realism counts as an art style. you dont need to know realism FULLY to be able to draw in a cartoony art style, however knowing proper anatomy does indeed help, and nothing is better than studying from life. i guess telling someone not to focus on art styles so much and rather on anatomy is a good point, but i think its ok to balance those two things out. you can learn what you like from other's people's art styles and study how they drew anatomy as well, maybe compare it to real life anatomy as well if youre a beginner.

another thing, in my opinion practice is a good advice to give as long as the critiquer shows you on WHAT exactly to practice and improve upon, such as, if you dont know how to draw hands, simply google hand pictures and study where and how the muscles go, how the light falls on it, etc etc. after all practice makes perfect.