Tachiyukan a dit :

a dit :VoirMasquer

Stop saying "deal with it" and start saying "how can we help you even if you're not getting unbanned." You may ask now, what are we supposed to do with these players, how could we help them? For starters, explain why and how they were banned, send them a list of the rules, give them advice to help them grow as a person.

I wholeheartedly agree with this, but as someone who was a public mod for a decent while it was disheartening to devote my time to the unfortunate few who's only response was to unban them or to go drown myself. This does not take away from the players who were ever so kind to me, their gratitude was my favourite part of my time as a mod. Helping even one player have a better experience was so wonderful, but being told and accused of really awful things does cause burnout, and no one deserve to be spoken to like that. Please be nice to each other guys.

You're one of the maybe 3 mods that I've ever accused of not doing their job correctly and your name is literally the only one that i remember clearly so it's interesting that you're saying this now. I remember messaging you about hackers teleporting on public racing (I start whispering mods only after reports didn't seem to be enough) numerous times on different occasions/days/weeks/months and I don't recall you EVER banning any of them. 90% of the time my messages are about hacks that you wouldn't miss just by taking a look at them, so it wasn't anything like leve or pulo that you or I could be wrong about. I know it's a normal thing to be afk sometimes and I'm not expecting every mod to be there 24/7 to fulfill my wishes but you were the one that from my perspective, never did what you were supposed to and asked to do. After a pretty long time I got tired of reporting blatant hackers to you with 0 effect and told you to do your job, to which you replied with "LOL". It was the only reply I've ever gotten from you and you still didn't ban the hacker who I reported earlier. I admit that my comment wasn't the nicest (still a lot better than the one about drowning), but my point stands - I didn't experience the "devotion" on your end whatsoever so please stop demonizing the players and think about what you did or didn't do to cause some of these accusations to arise

kinda irrelevant now since you're not a part of the staff anymore but I guess it still puts some things into perspective so I decided to reply

you know this whole thing reminds me of the mass staff exodus years ago in 2013. anyone else still remember that shitshow? gee i wonder why more former staff continue to voice their displeasurable experiences?

guess admins will NEVER learn from their mistakes :/

For some more background info read from here on: https://atelier801.com/topic?f=6&t=64554&p=66#m1318

I would like to join in on voicing my complaint against the ES mod Lezzly. I posted my situation in the Staff FAQ and while it got a decent amount of attention no tfm staff thought to reach out. I was banned in an EN parkour room for "hacking" by the ES mod lezzly. Now lets think about some things logically: my account is 9 years old with 0 sanctions, I have put hundreds into this game ( no doubt more than the average player) to support a game I have played since childhood, I was in the room with an actual parkour mod (who if I was hacking would obviously ban me?) and I even submitted a mod application for EN server to try and help a dying game, why would I ever hack? I reached out to lezzly and the only response I received was, https://prnt.sc/toe1hu, which besides being obviously very vague, was not informative at all. I tried to explain my side of the story and they never replied back.
After this I reached out to another moderator to try and explain and while I told them everything here they responded short and curt, just telling me to wait it out, and not even considerating that every story has two sides. I understand that most players appealing bans rightfully deserved them, but to just automatically assume seems unjust. I am not saying all moderators are like this, shoutout to Sav and Gavin, as they were very kind and helpful, but the fact that a mod can act this way with no repercussion is kind of absurd.
At this point my ban is almost over, and while people may think I am making this a bigger deal than it is, thats fine. However, as someone who has played this game for over 9 years, This type of moderation definitely plays a part in why the game is dying. After this interaction with the mod team, I can not continue supporting the company knowing this could happen anytime, and while this might not seem like much, Im pretty sure the admins can check how much i spend to know thats a solid loss of income.

Sofstatic a dit :

I would like to add something probably off-topic? ImO i think staff should stop using alts and work together instead of trying to hide? we always hear there are people modding on alts or main accounts if they have alts as public mods. Honestly its hard for people to communicate with mods for anything ( from a question to a ban or a convo ). Yes im well aware you guys get a lot of whispers at once and thats probably because you have 1 en mod online and 10 private ones and so on.

Thank you so much for the feedback everyone! I promise we're all discussing this behind the scenes and looking to improve the way we serve you as a community! ^0^

In addition to the lovely messages from other staff members, I'd also like to respond to this piece. The reason I, personally, mod on an alt is because I play AFK a lot on my main (aka having TFM open in the background while I work), and then we'd run into the problem of me not responding to whispers while online. Not being able to communicate with you all while I play was a major concern for me, thus I opted to moderate this way. I promise I'm not doing this "to hide", but rather to make communication easier with me when I have the time to moderate. Though I cannot speak for everyone's personal reasons, I can assure you none of us "alt mods" are doing this to avoid helping you in any capacity.

I'm sure many on the team would also agree that communication is an essential part of being a moderator, and I'd like to apologize if any of us have failed to meet your expectations. Please know that in addition to in-game whispers we do also respond to any message you may have (whether it be about the game, bans, or just a conversation) on the forum, and for most of us, on Discord as well. Sometimes you may catch us when we're busy and cannot respond right away, but your inquires do mean a lot, so please don't hesitate to message us.

a dit :

On the other hand, some people get banned, but this time, it is an unfair sanction placed on the player. If you are one of those players, you must know the struggle of trying to contact a mod just to be told that you should contact someone else... and when you do, that person says "I saw you hacking, you aren't getting unbanned". This is a serious issue that the staff members need to tackle and find a more efficient way of solving. I know there are some moderators with a good heart who will be lenient and remove the ban if it's the first sanction placed on the player or even a second sanction, but there are others who just don't care. Then, I must ask you, why are you a moderator? Just to place sanctions on people you think are breaking the rules and then not even give them a chance to explain themselves? If this happens once or twice a month, then it's not a huge issue to try and solve but the problem is that this happens almost daily on the game and people in the staff don't give a damn about trying to be more righteous. It's not an easy job but please try and be more correct and be extra-sure about sanctioning a rulebreaker. Don't just do it so you can move onto the next report.

@Visne, if you ever read this, does it sound any familiar to you? because it totally sounds like the things you do

I want to have a say in that, and I hope from the bottom of my heart that no staff will remove it, since it's just my opinion, my vision, and though I want to express it, I don't want anyone to feel like they should think the way I do.

First of all, I want to talk about the possible unrightfully sanctions applied to players, specially when it comes to hack. Unfortunately, some moderators have 0 knowledge to watch people hacking, and that's more than a fact. I've seen some of them banning people for "pulo alto" when they were only using a simple macro, which is a completely different thing, while a hack makes modifications in memory, a macro can only modify the speed of your keyboard. May you ask yourself if that's worrisome and if anyone should actually bring that up, and the answer is YES, it's very annoying to get unfairly banned, specially if you have experienced it at least, 2 times. As a racer, I know many players that have a messed up historic due to these sanctions, and it can be worse if you realise that now, if you get banned 2 times for the reason "Hack", your next sanction will be a permanent ban.(The Idea of finally giving cheaters a permaban is great, but what isn't great is how some people may lack knowledge to differ a 3rd-party software from a cheat). But since I am not a Hypocrite, I would also like to bring up what may could be the perspective of a moderator. This game changes for each Setup basically. If you use an outdated OS, such as windows XP/VISTA/7 your game will run way better; but if you have windows 10, you gonna have to witness the inconvenient graphic lags that won't go away WHATSOEVER. Speaking for myself, I have tried all my ways to find a solution, using non-official standalones with outdated versions of adobe ActiveX and nothing worked. The only standalone that wouldn't lag graphically at all was Steam, but Steam is one of the worst standalones ever made in my opinion. You won't witness the false FPS sensation, (The IPS may show 60, but it feels like 30/40) but you will have a lot of delay in your movements if you don't have a Graphic card, and your mouse will feel heavier. (that's kinda funny, cause no Standalone uses the GPU besides Steam, unless you put them all in fullscreen mode, still it's not a great usage).

But going straight to the point: Sometimes it's hard to know if someone is hacking or not when the game itself has dozens of variations when it comes to climbing a simple wall. Lemme give an example: https://youtu.be/vYuIOu_Z7XI. It's basically impossible to wj like that on that choco for some players, but it was very possible and natural for me in all those years. I could have been banned for that, cause it clearly gives me insane advantage compared to the rest of the players, even though, I wasn't willing to have any.

I would also like to reflect on a certain topic. I readed a few comments and I saw one talking about a certain argument, which many take as an excuse. The famous "it's just meli and tig now". I don't wanna disregard anyone's complaint on that, but unfortunately, it's not just a simple excuse. I do report flaws, cheats and I love to share my ideas to the staff but these suggestions require time to be read, understood, and thus possibly applied. If I intend to fix a hack, for example, in addition to studying a way to do so, I must also analyze how someone could break my own patch with a simple retro-engineer logic. And the game does not always support or have resources to satisfy the will of the players, this is something complicated to understand, but it is the purest and most painful truth. I would like to ask from the bottom of my heart, to stop demonizing Melibellule as if she does nothing for the game, which is something that is remarkable in her career and probably in her whole life. I don't want to play smart and use the classic "there is a lot of internal work" argument, but it's the truth. She is overwhelmed with tasks (Not only her). I see many saying that maybe this is a consequence of what could have been done in the past, but that it was ignored, and maybe it really is. But I don't want to come here and throw stones at someone who is not at his best mood and who is still learning every day. Guys, managing a company is not simple, and it is much more complicated when you do not have as much resources available or when you have only two people working on a game with a considerable number of players. my advice to the admins is to USE and ABUSE the willingness of players to help. At least, those with plausible solutions that can be taken into account. The fanbase of the game is very devout and I know a lot of people available. Unfortunately I don't think that what I wrote will reach the admin I wish he were here, sharing the bad moment with the players and listening to them, so i'm sorry if you Meli, who is already tired of knowing all this, had to read it all again.

Now I wanted to share my vision about maturity and about repenting and learning from mistakes. I have been a BoS for about a year and unfortunately, it is not easy or simple to learn from mistakes if you have an inflated ego or are a little "stubborn" as I was, so I can say that many here are. Acquiring responsibility to deal with the consequences of your own actions is essential, but it is a process that takes some time, I disagree with the part that says someone changes in weeks, Matt. It took me a considerable amount of time to really stop and look at everything I did and understand that it was serious and deserved the punishment applied. But until that time did not come, I tried to use excuses and even foul comparisons of what another player X did and that did not receive punishment. This does not disregard my own action, which was also terrible, but it's always easier to look at the person next to you and point out all the flaws instead of overcoming your own ego and becoming someone better, and this is a process that apparently has no end.

I also completely disagree with the part that says people should not really be assessed from previous sanctions (unless it has been years since the sanctions were applied). Unfortunately, anyone can pretend a certain behavior for a while and that does not make them suitable for a staff position that requires seriousness and commitment. There are people who are wise and know how to contain themselves and behave civilly, and there are those who will have to go through the worst until they get to the best of themselves, and that is natural in my view. I disagree with the part where Matt said that the staff only accepts their own friends, I think what you should really point out is that maybe, on the staff, there are groups of moderators who come together and agree on everything without questioning each other, and who may be rude even to other staff members who are new, or who disagree with them. This is unfortunately the reality in some cases, as I have seen from complaints from former staff. A positive change in my opinion was that at least, looking at the feedbacks, the "Players vs Staff" rivalry is no longer the same, at least I saw a great effort coming from the Staff of some communities to listen to the players.

I would like to make an addendum. I saw that many want the staff to be redone and that someone can be there all the time analyzing the movements to see if they are working correctly and unfortunately, this cannot be done at the moment. I also do not agree that the Staff has to be undone and redone.There are many Staff members who are too dedicated and it is not a rotten apple or two that should end this. It is also frustrating to receive generic responses like "we don't meddle in the bans of other staff members". Despite knowing how inconvenient it is that maybe someone else wants to teach you how to do a job in which you have had training to exercise, I believe that some staff members should be more analyzed because they break several rules or lack knowledge when doing a certain task . Not every ban will be fair, and although unjust sanctions are minorities, they should not be ignored just because they "can't get involved" in the ban applied by other staff. If a player presents evidence, and the sanction can bring about a doubtful situation, I believe that a reevaluation on it is deserved.

That's all I have to say, I may sound like a hypocrite to a few players or staff, knowing that I am banned on sight, but that's my opinion and I had no intention of reaching anyone in specific, just a SUPERFICIAL vision that is the result of my experience in the game. I hope it won't be deleted, I'm sorry and thank you.

Heya. Ediz here. Someone sent this link to me in private. Probably will be my first and last long post after a long time. This also probably is my first and only time where I'll be concerning where the staff has failed to meet the expectations of the public players.

I haven't been part of the staff since maybe 2015 or 2016, but this thread is just the perfect déjà vu that happens for every year, maybe even every few months since 2011. But I have been silently observing how Transformice has been processing in the background.

First of all, I would like to address and vouch that despite the fair complaints about the admins, I can only assure you that Melibellule was trying her best and she did truly care during my times. Even if she doesn't show it publicly as much as you guys wish, she does try her best to consider your point of view. I believe this is still the case today. I can say this, because back in then, I was one of the staff members who took a strong point of view against almost the whole admin team (and almost was kicked out because of that). But I saw them process as the complaints came by. There are a lot of background issues that we are not aware of, but of course this isn't the players or the staffs fault.

Is it enough? Perhaps not, but one can only do so much considering she's the only one handling like everything related to the community right now.

Regarding moderators... Oh are there so many issues with the whole Moderator team. Always did since 2011, and I'm not surprised that it still is going on here. As someone who spent a lot of time in both EN and TR as a staff member, whether it is in the game or in the forum, there are major behavioral and opressive flaws inside the team who try to dominate other staff members point of views.

There were moments where I had full proof that some moderators were shamaning themselves and get free cheese, moments where I saw moderators unfairly ban people right in front of myself, and moments where those unfairness has applied to myself.

I saw an English and Russian moderator insult a player right in front of my eyes in a private room and nothing happened to them. I know that this still happens to this day as I recently had proof that came to me.

I saw a moderator literally hack in front of my eyes, and nothing happened to them.

I even saw and had proof when supermods were a thing, made their own three accounts, and made each one a moderator, in order to favoritise a woman, just because she was a woman. She had a bad sanction history. Most mods knew this and they still tried to vote in favor of them, and nothing happened to that supermod (or the moderators). They quit themselves because I was not fired for "manipulating" the vote system as a non-moderator.

I will not make an exhaustive list here. There are tens and hundreds of reasons I could list, but it is not going to help anyone. The reason I'm listing some of them is to show that Moderators have the power over all the other staff members. Even the admins themselves, because admins don't want to get rid of their most of the staff and I can't blame them. Without the moderators, Transformice would be in the worse situation right now. It is a lose/lose situation in front of the players.

Another thing I fully agree, but also disagree is it takes only one mistake for a player to be rejected from a staff application. If you are friends with just one moderator, great! You will likely become a moderator as long as you are behaving well, all you just need to do is fake your behavior until you become a public moderator.

I know this, because I saw those moderators process from zero to a public staff, and for most of them, their behavior immediately change once they are promoted. They are no longer part of the players, they are part of something far more superior. This is how it is for a lot of them. They won't tell this to you, because as Peanut specified, most of it only happen internally.

After you are promoted to a private or public moderator, no one will question your behavior as long as it's not critically damaging the team. People accept this in the team as part of the reality and you just have to accept it whether you like it or not. There is definitely big brainwashing going on here where some moderators see it as real "tribe" and there are those "tribe leaders" who manipulate the voting system. If you disagree with those leaders, forget about becoming a public staff if you just joined the team. Or applying to the staff. You have to find those leaders and play along with them. I can also vouch for this, because I was part of this problem once upon a time and I acted up way too late to change the system. I'm sorry to those who were affected by this. This will likely never change because it means changing the whole moderation team without a "justifiable" reason.

But I also disagree with the friendship issue. No one is going to hire someone they don't know over someone who they already know and proved themselves to be part of the community. You have to make yourself seen if you want to be part of the team, whether it is through chat or through the reporting system. That's just how it is, even in real jobs, you will have better chance of getting the job if you have a reference in the team. It's easier to trust that way. The main problem here to this is this definitely should not overshadow the other applicants who are fair and decent players, but how do you see that they really are a decent player? It's a flaw in the system, not just here but also everywhere else, something that is neither the staffs fault or the applicants. You just keep trying again and again, until it just works out.

However, despite all of this, I can for sure say one thing, that still happens up to today: Some moderators may have a bad attitude and be flawed in many ways, but at least the way I see it, most of them are doing their job most of the time.

Most people I see claim they are unfairly banned, but fail to come up with a reasonable and detailed excuse to justify their reasoning. The exceptions don't change this fact. I think as far as the status of the game goes, and all the issues that arises every now and then, we should be appreciating the volunteer work they do (at least I hope this is the case still) in the direction the game is facing. It's better than having a community without any staff members at all.

Okay, I wasn't going to bring this up since I've had nothing but good experience with this sentinel but it's very relevant to your contention with the staff accepting their friends regardless of merit.
Why exactly is Sollyun an EN sentinel? I, in no way, mean this in a hostile manner but it can't be asked in any other way. I guess my main concern is that he isn't fluent enough in English to hold a staff position in the EN staff team. For the couple of months I've been a sentinel, I could see that he struggled to articulate his thoughts efficiently in English. If my memory serves me well, he was a BR sent before switching to EN. And it really begs the question. Was there a legitimate process to see if he could navigate himself well in the EN community or was he just accepted because he had friends in the EN sent team?
Again, this is not to shit on him in anyway, I have no doubt that he's knowledgeable about the forums and how they operate but I can't help but think that his not-so-great communication skills in English leave room for mistakes/underperformance.
Could any sentinel clear this up?

Sharpmuffinz a dit :

I would like to join in on voicing my complaint against the ES mod Lezzly. I posted my situation in the Staff FAQ and while it got a decent amount of attention no tfm staff thought to reach out. I was banned in an EN parkour room for "hacking" by the ES mod lezzly. Now lets think about some things logically: my account is 9 years old with 0 sanctions, I have put hundreds into this game ( no doubt more than the average player) to support a game I have played since childhood, I was in the room with an actual parkour mod (who if I was hacking would obviously ban me?) and I even submitted a mod application for EN server to try and help a dying game, why would I ever hack? I reached out to lezzly and the only response I received was, https://prnt.sc/toe1hu, which besides being obviously very vague, was not informative at all. I tried to explain my side of the story and they never replied back.
After this I reached out to another moderator to try and explain and while I told them everything here they responded short and curt, just telling me to wait it out, and not even considerating that every story has two sides. I understand that most players appealing bans rightfully deserved them, but to just automatically assume seems unjust. I am not saying all moderators are like this, shoutout to Sav and Gavin, as they were very kind and helpful, but the fact that a mod can act this way with no repercussion is kind of absurd.
At this point my ban is almost over, and while people may think I am making this a bigger deal than it is, thats fine. However, as someone who has played this game for over 9 years, This type of moderation definitely plays a part in why the game is dying. After this interaction with the mod team, I can not continue supporting the company knowing this could happen anytime, and while this might not seem like much, Im pretty sure the admins can check how much i spend to know thats a solid loss of income.

Even if your ban is almost up, I would continue fighting to have this removed from your sanction history. It would be awful to have that weighing against you when accused in the future, or when applying for various things.

Just reposting to let you know that I finished my edited version.

Hopefully, anyway

Also edit again (last time for real): This is probably me making my peace with the game and staff. There are some moderators and staff members who are invaluable to me and I really appreciate meeting them and learnt a lot from them, and shared a lot of fun times, but it doesn't change the fact about how the majority of the team was during my time. I'm sorry if my post has let you down, but it needed to be said as the thread is out there. I tried my best to write it as fair as possible because I know not all of you deserve this and a lot of you still try to do your best to make this game going fair and well. Thank you for being part of the community and staff despite everything going on.